Didn’t we try the whole Dems helping Republicans thing before? And didn’t that get us into this whole-ass mess to begin with, Hillary?
I’m sure Biden won’t ignore WI, MI, PA this time around like Hillary did.
In fairness I blame Stein for that shit. Her voters would have flipped every single one of those states had Putin not been encouraging her to spoil in favor of the wannabe authoritarian.
I blame Hillary. Stein ran her campaign, and Hillary didn’t do enough to get enough votes.
Not to replay previous elections but seriously, if Hillary had visited just a few of the states she completely wrote off maybe she’d have gotten a couple vote there. I’m pretty left of center so I’ll vote my interests anyway but not even being worth a visit is a bit of a slap in the face to a whole lot of people who at least want to feel heard.
I won’t say you’re wrong but how ridiculous is it that people need someone to come to their state to gain their vote?
Get the fuck over yourself.
Actually, I just decided if Joe doesn’t knock on my door himself he can forget about it.
I hated her and sat out the vote because I didn’t think it was possible for the other to win. Dems are to blame for running someone so unlikeable. They’re doing it again, only to a lesser degree.
Nah, if Nader wasn’t here we wouldn’t have had Iraq, and if Stein wasn’t we wouldn’t have had Dobbs.
The green party are fascist collaborators and deserve no deflection from their responsibility in holding america back in the name of their white left bullshit allowing the right to drag this country further and further off track in the name of “teaching those establishment dems a lesson.”
We could have had better education standards, made headway on climate change, and avoided the 6-3 court taking away women’s reproductive rights, but nah, lets blame the dems who’d have stopped that shit for the Green Party being knowing spoilers upto and including taking RNC money to keep doing it.
When we achieve the multipartisan pluralistic democracy this country needs the current greens will be wiped out and replaced, because they’re not a real party with real political goals, they’re a russian and RNC backed professional spoiler club who exist only to let the white left pretend the continued degradation of this country is the fault of the people out to halt or reverse it because,
“well you didn’t make me want to vote for you as hard as this obvious straw-candidate who’s literally taking money from the folks out to destroy everything I claim to value more than rubbing it in your face that it’s your fault I’m doing nothing to help.”
You folks still trying to blame hillary for Stein stabbing everyone in the back are the epitome of the “look what you made me do!” domestic abuser.
Deny, Accuse, Reverse Victim and Offender,
That didn’t happen. And if it did, it wasn’t that bad. And if it was, that’s not a big deal. And if it is, that’s not my fault. And if it was, I didn’t mean it. And if I did, you deserved it.
We’re going to see queer folks be hunted for sport by the end of next year because people like you can’t just admit that shit is better when the Republicans are not let into at least one branch of government than when they aren’t.
We literally have observable proof that the biggest improvements to life in this country come when the dems are given the margin to just do shit without having to spending months prying it from the right, but nah, let’s teach them another lesson by letting the Rs back into power so they can reverse Obergefell with a 9-0 majority this time instead!
That will teach those old white folks that won’t be personally impacted at all and not just prove that the white left is not and has never been any sort of ally to the queer community!
Least unhinged liberal
Your assumption that if there were no 3rd party candidates we would have voted for your neoliberal POS is incorrect. The 15% of Dems that switched to Republican in 2000 had more impact on Bush winning than the 3% that voted for Nader. Gore couldn’t even win his home state, had he done that he could have lost Florida and still won the election.
Clinton did absolutely nothing to earn votes in 2016 and didn’t even try, her entitled hubris demanded any vote not going to the GOP was hers.
Yes, Clinton supporters blame everyone but Clinton for the loss she earned.
Well, Debbie Schultz has some blame too, Hillary shouldn’t have even have won the primary.
No. Can they count?
Haley isn’t going to win but voting for her in the primaries will help fracture the republican party further.
Or it won’t. It will look like they are more popular and bolster the outlook for the party.
If she wins the primaries, there’s no way Trump won’t run as an independent.
Yeah but Haley doesn’t validate rural white voters wanting to say the N word without social consequences the way Trump does.
Trump promises to make the grandkids start coming home for christmas again, Haley promises to return to the Republicans paying the nominal lipservice to that mentality being a bad thing that was driving trump’s supporters nuts with the party before the brass bullshitter came along.
The net effect will more likely be trump still winning and then either Haley’s supporters feeling alienated from how much Trump goes feral against her in the process, or Trump is blocked from running and he still loses via a write in third party run from the cult of trump
She didn’t list slavery as a reason for the Civil War. She’d absolutely validate the racists if she got the nomination.
Stop playing fucking metagames and learn how to govern.
That would be the most Dem thing Dems have ever done. Play games and get Haley elected when Biden would have just cruised over trump.
I don’t suspect Biden will just cruise over Trump. Look at the polls, Trump leads in swing states. I hope Biden can win, but it won’t be easy.
Don’t mention polling. Centrists hate it because it indicates that their constant shift rightward has become unpopular.
Actual results since roe was overturned have been ~+9 towards dem/dem supported policies than polling has said. I still have hope.
If he’s lost the Muslim vote, hopefully he has, he’s gonna lose by enormous numbers. The numbers from 2020 support this.
Georgia won by 11k votes - has 120k Muslims Arizona won by 10k votes has 109k Muslims Wisconsin won by 20k votes - has 68k Muslims Pennsylvania won by 80k votes has 150k Muslims Michigan won by 150k votes - has 241k Muslims
Haley isn’t getting elected. She has virtually no path towards the GOP nomination. If she did, MAGATs aren’t going to vote for her unless he was on the ballot, and then if she did put him on the ballot, she’ll lose the moderate votes.
Trump has a chance to cause chaos by losing another general election. He could also do even more damage by winning another general election. Haley, if she somehow won the primary and general, would be so much less destructive.
So yeah, voting for Haley in the primary is the fucking move and it’s why I didn’t vote for Biden in the SC primary.
Nikki Haley’s Sudden Wealth Rooted in Weapons Industry, Pro-War Advocacy Network.
The former U.N. ambassador went from virtually no savings in 2017 to a small fortune in part from defense contracting and war advocacy ties.
Look, no Democrat is saying she’d be great or even close to being better than Biden.
But she’d certainly be better than Trump. And if she can split the Republican votes in the general election, even better.
No, she wouldn’t be. Trump at least has value from an accelerationist POV, Haley’s going to do all things Trump would but as less of a publicly shitposting moron.
Fuck that shit. Trump would only accelerate towards fascism and the lil’ tankies pretending otherwise would be like the clown car convoy in Texas.
Except unlike those in Texas, they would have cops happily bashing in their skulls why they wonder why the country hasn’t descended into civil war against Trump.
Meanwhile Israel would be given carte blanche to genocide on a far grander scale, Russia would be genociding Ukrainians, and the Taiwanese would be sold off to China in a dodgy backroom deal, the environment would be even more fucked then under a libshit government, and people worldwide would suffer more than they already are.
If you want to accelerate something, go sacrifice your life and assassinate a Republican politician not hand them the keys to the world’s largest army.
Hear hear.
I think Biden is the accelerationist candidate. Why? Bc if Trump wins, the system will just roll over and enforce his whims. The Dems will just accept it, and there likely will never be any more democracy. It will be much harder to force change. However, if Biden wins, the right will not accept it. Either the republicans will attempt to disrupt the election results, or the right will escalate domestic terrorism, etc.
It’s okay to not have opinions on things
I don’t care if she sucks. She won’t beat Trump in the end. The longer she stays in the race, the more angry he’s gonna get at his own party
She wins the primary if SCOTUS rules that Trump is an insurrectionist, and she polls well against Biden precisely because she appeals to “enlightened centrists.”
The question is not whether Trump should be barred as insurrectionist. The question is what candidate the leash holders of certain Justices want.
Jesus Christ when are you gonna learn that these stupid 4d chess moves don’t fucking work? You’re gonna be literally supporting republicans, and when that gets a republican in office again you’re probably gonna blame 3rd party voters and leftists and young people and Russia and literally everyone other than yourself for republicans winning. This shit backfires all the time, don’t fuck us all over with this “big brain” bullshit again please
seriously. i have a policy that i only vote for someone if i want them to have the office (i know, i’m a fucking lunatic).
Why the fuck are liberals still doing this shit? Was getting trump elected not enough of a sign that it’s stupid and doesn’t work??
It’s like they forgot Hillary Clinton literally propped up Trump because she thought he’d never win.
Because even if Haley won “by accident” that’s still infinitely better than Trump.
Not really. She is still likely to enact project 2025 upon taking office. To paraphrase one conservative, she is really good at looking like a normal politician. She’s a confederate zombie back from the dead.
And you think, what, it can’t get worse than that? Fuck, man. Listen to what Orange Jesus is saying.
I think Nikki Haley is going to do the things Trump is saying, she just isn’t saying them. If any Republican presidential candidate takes office next year, it is likely we will end up in a christofascist dictatorship.
Here is some current polling:
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/national/
Polling this early on isn’t that meaningful. I think what it does illustrate is that Biden isn’t obviously dominating in a Biden-Haley match up. If anything it looks Haley beats Biden by a larger margin than Trump does.
Rather than trying to support Haley because she is perceived to be less of a fascist, she’s not, or because Biden will do better against her in a general election, as far as we know, he won’t, we should focus on pressuring Biden to enact policy changes that his voting base are demanding.
For example, a lot of younger voters are frustrated by Biden’s handling of the current Palestinian-Israeli conflict. We should direct our time and energy on getting Biden to change his outdated views on Israel.
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I think she’d win in a head to head against Biden. Unless trump, which he would, sabotages her at every chance they get.
I can pretty much guarantee that bidens folks want to run against the guy who keeps losing vs a young competent woman.
Don’t confuse my thoughts with support. I don’t like her, I’m just realistic.
young competent woman.
competent ? hmmmmm
more than trump perhaps.
Eh say what you will but she is competent
She’s not terrible but even the GOP could do better. Also, were I Haley, I’d just point out that if she’s as bad as Trump insinuates - why the fuck did he hire her lol? TO THE UN? like holy shit donny, you’re shitting on yourself you moron. but he can’t help it, he’s bonkers.
DONNY CAN’T EVEN FIND LAWYERS THAT HAVE LAPTOPS.
After living through the last few elections, I’m not going to bet on whether Biden vs Haley or Biden vs Trump will lead to a better result. But I really don’t see how helping Haley would actually accomplish anything. Even if the Democrats made a big (wasted) effort to push & campaign for Haley, it’s not going to be nearly enough to make her the nominee.
Absent the Supreme Court declaring Trump ineligible (don’t hold your breath) It’s going to be Biden vs Trump. Prepare for that. Messing with the Republican’s sham primary is a waste of effort and a distraction from more constructive things Democrats could be doing like getting their voters registered and ready to go to the polls in November.
They don’t want her to win though, they want her to convince some republicans to hate Trump enough to vote for Joe or not vote at all. Come to think of it, it is a pretty similar strategy to the one the Republicans have been running for years—use the underdog to neuter the bruiser before they even get to the big match.
I can think of three people I know personally who went from Bernie to Trump in 2016. It’s not a bad strategy.
I’m sorry if this is offensive, but those three people sound like utter dolts. Talk about not knowing what you want…
what no they’re dumb as hell. their justification was “I don’t want another politician”.
thing is, they’re also frustrated and afraid and in that they’re absolutely correct. no matter what you believe the causes and solutions are, people are noticing that they’re working harder, paying more and in a much more precarious position for it than the generations before them. part of the reason that fascism is doing so well is that the people getting fucked know they need a change, and fascism is the change that the ruling class won’t oppose so they actually feel like they can get it. they’re not gonna love it when society runs out of queers and foreigners to destroy and they end up being the enemy of the week instead, but for right now all they can see is the walls of the current system closing in on them. in that situation, one where inaction is going to mean immediate destruction, a course shift into trumpism is a way of staying alive today and hoping you can figure out a way to unfuck things later.
If Trump is disqualified or drops out or drops dead - Nicky Haley would actually win against Biden right? And she’s a fucking nutjob too. I mean they all are.
If the election was held today and Trump was the republican nominee, Biden would lose. If the election was held today and Haley was the republican nominee, Biden would lose.
It’s so bizarre to me how out of touch people are with the actual state of the electorate. Joe Biden has consistently had one of the the lowest approval ratings of any president in modern history.
For comparison, at this point in his presidency Trump, who also had historically low approval ratings, had approval ratings 5% higher than Biden does now.
Let me say that again. Donald “Bigly” Trump, very stable genius esq., was and continues to be a more popular president than Joe Biden.
The problem is Biden, and we’re all just sleepwalking into a furnace.
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Right wingers support right wingers. Who knew?
Who knew?
Pied Piper 2.0?
