What happens in November is up to Biden – it will not be the fault of the protest voter if Trump is elected. The questions remain: does the Democratic party fear Trump as much as we do? And does it value its voters enough to shift away from an approach to the onslaught in Gaza that a majority of Democratic voters are against?

  • eran_morad@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    24
    arrow-down
    5
    ·
    edit-2
    4 months ago

    I’m just tryna vote for the lesser, by far, of two evils. It’s a fucking binary system, you can stomp your feet all you want and still get a genocide and possibly much worse, or you can at least preserve hope for a better future.

    • inclementimmigrant@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      7
      ·
      4 months ago

      Same but in the mean time I’m going to continue to donate and help push for progressives and those who keep fighting to get rid of the bullshit first past the post voting system and electoral college bullshit.

    • TokenBoomer@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      4 months ago

      Hope for whom? A better future for whom? If personal selfishness outweighs the value of humanity, then we’ve already lost, and the outcome of the election is irrelevant.

    • Xanis@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      5
      arrow-down
      5
      ·
      4 months ago

      It’s reaaaaaaaaaaaaaally simple:

      Voting Biden in gives us time to take all this energy we’re mustering up and using it to promote broader, more significant changes. We don’t stop at the election and instead use the next four years to push toward a better tomorrow.

      Too many people are stopping at Trump v. Biden. Too many more are stopping at Them v “The System”.

      Change takes time. When you vote for Biden, you vote to reset the clock, and then it’s time for all of us to get to work.

      • Krono@lemmy.today
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        6
        ·
        4 months ago

        Can you explain how you expect to push for a better tomorrow after Biden is re-elected?

        The reason I am reluctant to vote for Biden is that he is supporting genocide. If Biden continues to give away large quantities of child-exploding bombs, and he is still rewarded with reelection, then what leverage will the anti-genocide movement have left?

        It seems like if Biden can ignore the anti-genocide movement and still win, then we can expect Biden to keep ignoring for 4 more years.

          • Krono@lemmy.today
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            5
            arrow-down
            4
            ·
            4 months ago

            I expect Trump to do horrible things. I expect Trump to be worse than Biden.

            What does that have to do with my questions?

            • Xanis@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              4
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              edit-2
              4 months ago

              It has everything to do with your question. Biden has already proven he is willing to roll over on many issues. Biden has gotten a lot done these last four years, far more than most of us expected. Meanwhile, and I am NOT downplaying the severity of the genocide, people like you are using that in exactly the same way you accuse people like me of using Trump. Thing is your reluctance to help Biden get into office, and acknowledgement of the likely atrocities Trump would attempt, does you no favors. You can’t see past your own anger to the bigger picture, and it’s a damn shame. Because where Biden buys us time to continue coming together and push for change, Trump will attempt to lock us, and the very many minorities, LGPTQ+ communities, and any person not white and certainly anyone who stands against him, possibly and quite literally behind bars. He is so damned bad that the ENTIRE WORLD was pushing back against his Presidency and are terrified of him winning again. Except Russia.

              Either we step the fuck up and stop being bitches and work together for a change over the next few years, or all this shit, every single part of it, will occur again in 2028. Including, as happens nearly every god damn fucking time, a serious situation that splits our attention and our support while the Right looks on and smirks. Every. Time. And we keep falling for it because we care.

              • Krono@lemmy.today
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                4 months ago

                I’m not angry, I was asking an honest question that no one has answered yet: how?

                You say you take the genocide seriously, and you say electing Biden is buying us time to push for change, so answer my question then:

                How will we effectively push the Biden administration to change Gaza policy after he is re-elected?

            • abracaDavid@lemmy.today
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              4
              arrow-down
              4
              ·
              4 months ago

              Because that is literally the entire campaign for the DNC: “but what about Trump!”.

              They love Trump because he’s the ultimate boogeyman to strong-arm voters to fall into line.

          • nondescripthandle@lemmy.dbzer0.com
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            3
            arrow-down
            5
            ·
            edit-2
            4 months ago

            I expect Trump to continue being a boogeyman so people like you can keep saying this instead of working for any real change that makes people’s lives better. ‘Just push Biden left’ turned into ‘Well you have no other choice’ real quick.

    • juicy@lemmy.todayOP
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      8
      arrow-down
      18
      ·
      4 months ago

      Lesser of two evils works when we’re talking about blocking universal healthcare or police reform. When you use that bullshit to justify pulling the lever for genocide, you just don’t care that much about genocide.

      • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        16
        arrow-down
        6
        ·
        4 months ago

        And when you use that justification to enable someone who’s going to increase support of that genocide what does that make you? Sure sounds like you’re supporting more genocide than a Biden voter is.

        • harrys_balzac@lemmy.dbzer0.com
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          13
          arrow-down
          5
          ·
          4 months ago

          It’s like people forgot how many Americans died during the height of the pandemic because T**** is a fucking idiot.

          Anyone who is even remotely near the crosshairs of the Christofascists needs to pull their head out of their ass and vote Democrat this election.

          The Republicunts don’t care if you think “both sides are bad” if you’re LGBTQ+, atheist, non-Christian, think abortion should be freely available, etc.

          Ideals and principles don’t stop bullets or beatings.

        • NoIWontPickAName@kbin.earth
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          4
          arrow-down
          12
          ·
          4 months ago

          Hey, how about you just work with us this time and then here in four years we will pretend to care about what you wanna do.

          That seems to be the Democrat playbook anymore

          • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            7
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            4 months ago

            Which is exactly why you shouldn’t be just tuning in every 4 years. Local elections, primaries, etc. People only pay attention every 4 years. That’s part of the reason why we’re here.

          • Railing5132@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            8
            arrow-down
            5
            ·
            4 months ago

            Oh suck rocks. There’s one party that does try to pass legislation that helps people, that is better for the environment, better allocations of spending priorities, and generally aren’t fucking cartoon villains.

            And it ain’t the Republicans.

            Being mad that things weren’t done the way we Think They Should Be™ and dismissing the realization that geopolitics is an extremely complex system is childish. Throwing temper tantrums, threatening to take your toys and go home because you didn’t get your way is childish.

            There are many factions to appease in the US electorate, particularly on the left. And while I personally feel like Israel should have been cut off decades ago which may have saved hundreds of thousands of lives, there are a lot more who feel differently. Am I going to hold that against the group that aligns with the majority of my aspirations even if they are stymied by christofacists at every turn? FUCK NO.

                • NoIWontPickAName@kbin.earth
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  4
                  arrow-down
                  3
                  ·
                  4 months ago

                  My guy, do you not understand that human lives are more important than anything else he can do?

                  He disregards that, and I’m ok with not being on team “Okay with killing children to get the other things we want.”

                  That is your team

          • Jackie's Fridge@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            4
            arrow-down
            1
            ·
            4 months ago

            You’re not wrong, but it beats the GOP’s playbook, and it’ll buy us some time to do the actual work of building a viable third party that might have a chance after 20 years of constant support from local elections on up.

            Not voting sends no message other than you’re fine with how things are so you can’t be bothered. Threatening a comfy 2-party system with a solid alternative will make them sweat.

      • Cryophilia@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        0
        ·
        4 months ago

        You’re standing in a room with two levers. If you pull the left one, five people die. If you pull the right one, ten people die. If you don’t pull one, it’s random, either five or ten people die.

        So if you choose not to pull, and ten people die, would you feel guilty for the five additional people? You could have prevented their deaths.