Update:
The comments from this post will not be removed as to preserve the discussion around the announcement. Any continued discussions outside of this thread that violate server rules will be removed. We feel that everyone that has an opinion, and wanted to vent, has been heard.

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Original post:
Yesterday, we received information about the planned federation by Hexbear. The announcement thread can be found here: https://www.hexbear.net/post/280770. After reviewing the thread and the comments, it became evident that allowing Hexbear to federate would violate our rules.

Our code of conduct and server rules can be found here.

The announcement included several concerning statements, as highlighted below:

  • “Please try to keep the dirtbag lib-dunking to hexbear itself. Do not follow the Chapo Rules of Posting, instead try to engage utilizing informed rhetoric with sources to dismantle western propaganda. Posting the western atrocity propaganda and pig poop balls is hilarious but will pretty quickly get you banned and if enough of us do it defederated.”
  • “The West’s role in the world, through organizations such as NATO, the IMF, and the World Bank - among many others - are deeply harmful to the billions of people living both inside and outside of their imperial core.”
  • “These organizations constitute the modern imperial order, with the United States at its heart - we are not fooled by the term “rules-based international order.” It is in the Left’s interest for these organizations to be demolished. When and how this will occur, and what precisely comes after, is the cause of great debate and discussion on this site, but it is necessary for a better world.”

The rhetoric and goal of Hexbar are clear based on their announcement: to “dismantle western propaganda” and "demolish organizations such as NATO” shows that Hexbar has no intention of "respecting the rules of the community instance in which they are posting/commenting.” It’s to push their beliefs and ideology.

In addition, several comments from a Hexbear admin, demonstrate that instance rules will not be respected.

Here are some examples:

“I can assure you there will be no lemmygrad brigades, that energy would be better funneled into the current war against liberalism on the wider fediverse.”

“All loyal, honest, active and upright Communists must unite to oppose the liberal tendencies shown by certain people among us, and set them on the right path. This is one of the tasks on our ideological front.”

Overall community comments:

To clarify, for those who have inquired about why Hexbear versus Lemmygrad, it should be noted that we are currently exploring the possibility of defederating from Lemmygrad as well based on similar comments Hexbear has made.

Defederation should only be considered as a last resort. However, based on their comments and behavior, no positive outcomes can be expected.

We made the decision to preemptively defederate from Hexbear for these reasons. While we understand that not everyone may agree with our decision, we believe it is important to prioritize the best interests of our community.

  • redtea@lemmygrad.ml
    136·
    1 year ago

    That’s partly because ‘tankies’ read theory. Liberal theory, Marxist theory, all of it that they can get their hands on. According to both liberal and Marxist theory, liberalism is the main ideology of capitalism. When ‘tankies’ oppose ‘liberals’, they are talking about the ‘progressive’ left of the Anlgo-European empire and what that ‘left’ calls ‘conservatives’. So if conservatives laugh when ‘tankies’ make fun of liberals, the joke’s on them because the ‘tankie’ means them, too.

    There is absolutely no defence of fascism from ‘tankies’. That term usually refers to Marxist-Leninists, who praise Stalin and Mao for their stances against fascism, colonialism, and imperialism. If nothing else (and there is a lot ‘else’), anti-fascism is a central tenet of ‘tankie’ ideology and practice. Anti-fascism is/was a core tenet of all Marxist parties. If you think that a ‘tankie’ is ‘defending fascism’, you have misunderstood what they are saying and/or have inferred something from their words that they did not intend. Horseshoe theory is an intellectually bankrupt ‘theory’.

    You are right about this:

    We are inherently a position of compromise[.]

    As Mao said:

    … liberalism rejects ideological struggle and stands for unprincipled peace, thus giving rise to a decadent, Philistine attitude and bringing about political degeneration[.]

    This and the other types of liberalism are often what ‘tankies’ are challenging when they criticise ‘liberals’—not what counts as ‘liberal’ in the extremely narrow US electoral politics sense of the term.

    • Puzzle_Sluts_4Ever@lemmy.world
      98·
      1 year ago

      Leftists are not tankies. If all you are doing is criticizing liberal institutions and capitalism, you are… a leftist.

      If you are going above and beyond to treat “liberalism” as the greatest threat to humanity while simultaneously ignoring, or outright endorsing, the actions of demonstrably horrifying “communist” regimes? You are a tankie and you are a problem and… kind of a fascist. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tankie is a good breakdown

      Being a Lefitst or even an outright worshipper of Marxism-Leninism is not a bad thing (I would argue being a Leftist is an objectively good thing since that tends to be very heavily based on social justice and egalitarianism). But a refusal to acknowledge where past efforts went wrong (if only to learn from them) and an active defense of where it went wrong is bad.

      And while you can have one without the other, saying nonsense like… basically every single quote in the OP is a real big red flag. If only because… a lot of countries should PROBABLY be dismantled if we want to actually make the world a better place. US is definitely up there. So is Russia and China. And arguably large parts of the EU (since they find good ways to still exploit the global south in the name of profits).

      Its just like how people can support aspects of Capitalism without thinking we need full on US/China levels of horror on that front. Or how people can think Communism is a good form of government while still being able to condemn the horrifying abominations that the Soviet Union and the like were (which, honestly, a lot of that boils down to actually being capitalist at its core due to the resource scarcity and bribes).

      To put an intentionally provocative invocation of Godwin’s Law into play. It is very much possible to discuss Nazi technology and praise it (even if that mostly just indicates that you don’t understand logistics or what makes sense during a war versus peace time…). But if you start talking about how the STG-44 was a work of art rifle and amazing and don’t even say “But, just to be clear. Nazis are bad. Shouldn’t have to say it but…” then… that raises some HUGE red flags.

      Which, again, same for Communism. You can praise the good and even argue about how the bad could have been avoided. But you kind of have to acknowledge the bad because of how many people suffered horribly under those regimes.