Is it the employer’s responsibility to help pay someone more than they are worth, who wasted their life instead of getting good at something?
Your classism is leaking through in your shoddy logic that implies someone that demands a low market wage “wasted their life”. I think it speaks a lot about someone that conflates remuneration and the good life. Like, rich people kill themselves all the time, which suggest there’s no relationship between the two. Rich people also do immoral shit all the time, which leads to a really bad time eventually, like going to prison. So, again…that suggests no relationship between the two. And yet here you are…
Anyway, you know what else is true? Just because something is always true doesn’t mean it must be the way it is. Not that this is my preferred solution, but if rich people want to fuck over everyone, then there shouldn’t be rich people. Thus, what you said can be true and the forces that encourage cheap immigrant labor won’t have a chance to manifest. Then we have both immigrants and good jobs. See how I didn’t have to scapegoat innocent people who are not “wasting their life” by “getting good at something”? It’s funny that you ask me vote against them now while disparaging them before.
The person most responsible for yourself will always be yourself.
Classism. Lol some rich kid who took to much shit college is gonna lecture me on what class I am.
then there shouldn’t be rich people.
Again there will always be rich people because some people are just better than other people. You will never stop that. There will be moms who smoke crack pregnant and make a dumb kid. Some people are just genetically unlucky. You can change who the current rich people are. That’s called war. But you will just switch who the rich people are. Not remove them.
Go see the grand daughter of Mao Zi Dong in China.
She is rich. Because all they did about classism is kill some of the current rich people, along with a bunch of poor people and make new rich people.
Then we have both immigrants and good job
Just shows how little you understand about supple and demand and how finite resources work.
Did you not understand my example?
If a boss makes 90k per year how can he pay his cleaner 80k per year?
He can’t. You can make everyone poor I guess. But it will be worse not better than capitalism. And eventually capitalism will come back because it’s the natural way of producing goods and services
Lol some rich kid who took to much shit college is gonna lecture me on what class I am.
I get “good at something” and don’t “waste my life”, and you denigrate me for it. This just goes to show it’s never about the other person. There’s something wrong with you that allows you to treat people who don’t get good at something and fail to become successful (financially) poorly and do the same to those who do.
Also, I didn’t say what class you’re in. Poor people can be as classist as the rich, and often are.
If a boss makes 90k per year how can he pay his cleaner 80k per year?
It was six years ago when CEO Dan Price raised the salary of everyone at his Seattle-based credit card processing company Gravity Payments to at least $70,000 a year. Price slashed his own salary by $1 million to be able to give his employees a pay raise. He was hailed a hero by some and met with predictions of bankruptcy from his critics. But that has not happened; instead, the company is thriving.
It makes sense that you’d think it’s impossible because capitalism emaciates the political imagination. A CEO must make way more than the lowest paid employee! Except that isn’t a law of nature. It’s a choice by the executive management. The fact that everyone makes the wrong does not make it right.
Okay, this is boring. I’ll see you on another thread.
That dude still owned the fucking company. And it was a publicity stunt. Elon musk goes years without a paycheck. That doesn’t mean anything. The CEO still owned the company which is worth millions when he sells it.
You keep using the word Capitalism in your critique but have not given a single example of a working solution. That spans whole economies. Because you can’t. Every attempt has failed.
Like, rich people kill themselves all the time, which suggest there’s no relationship between the two
Posting a fallacy. Everyone knows rich people are on average happier than poor people. Up to a certain point it has a massive improvement in happiness and stagnates above a certain point.
There are dozens of studies that show that wealth correlates with happiness. Which is kinda obvious as well.
So yes, there is a correlation.
Again, your issue is with democracy and not capitalism. Its a flawed system but the only one that will ever work in this world.
Any other option never worked out and usually had genocides as result.
If anything, the problem is probably more with the Republic concept rather than democracy. Democracy has its problem of that the minority always loses, but Republics… That’s just putting power into the hands of the few. Which tends to come back to the wealthy.
Its a flawed system but the only one that will ever work in this world.
What do you mean “work”? Because fuedalism “worked” just fine, too, along with monarchies and other forms of government and distributions of power. They all “worked” just fine…for everybody that wasn’t oppressed by it. I’m not sure how capitalism meaningfully differs in that respect from any of the other versions.
Your problems are all related to economics and can be fixed with the right laws. Capitalism just has the inherent problem of edging on the border of abuse of the working man if not left in check.
Democracy with short term roles has the issue of politicians chasing short term goals to convince the public to vote for them again.
We get those weird situations in which some folks get massive taxbreaks and others get nothing nada.
Capitalism just has the inherent problem of edging on the border of abuse of the working man if not left in check.
Not just the working man. Climate change is a direct response to fossil fuel executives knowing the potential for climate change and then going out their way to suppress that information for decades. Infamously known for his appreciation of capitalism, part of Marx’s criticism of capitalism was that it devoured everything.
I’m not sure there’s a such thing as “right” laws, but yes, laws can address some of the issues. But that’s like chaining a killer dog: the second you get lax, your dog might end up doing what comes naturally to it.
I agree partly. Mostly because the last couple years we are following the best case scenario scientists predicted, and capitalism lets people innovate. We have electric cars, solarpanels etc which are cheaper than fossil fuels for the average consumer.
And these products are getting cheaper over time as capitalism supports price competition. Not to mention the fact any government can subsidize and help their paying tax members transition to a greener alternative.
If we keep up as we do now fossil fuels will be more expensive and we will transition to a fuel free future.
Capitalism might be ripe for abuse but any economic model can be abused by a bad actor. At least with capitalism its easier to turn the tide.
I personally wouldnt even read any commie literature written decades ago as its outdated in this global economy and most of the literature doesnt apply to this society. Not to mention any of the numerous attempts failed so far. Biggest example being China which switched over and got a massive economic boost and is investing billions in green energy. When they had communism as main drive millions died of hunger. Look at them now.
A true utopia would be a fascist model in which one person will decide the course of action for a plethora of decades to reform and build changes towards a green future. That will never happen.
Side note, I dont like the word “climate change”. My preference would be “climate crisis”.
Your classism is leaking through in your shoddy logic that implies someone that demands a low market wage “wasted their life”. I think it speaks a lot about someone that conflates remuneration and the good life. Like, rich people kill themselves all the time, which suggest there’s no relationship between the two. Rich people also do immoral shit all the time, which leads to a really bad time eventually, like going to prison. So, again…that suggests no relationship between the two. And yet here you are…
Anyway, you know what else is true? Just because something is always true doesn’t mean it must be the way it is. Not that this is my preferred solution, but if rich people want to fuck over everyone, then there shouldn’t be rich people. Thus, what you said can be true and the forces that encourage cheap immigrant labor won’t have a chance to manifest. Then we have both immigrants and good jobs. See how I didn’t have to scapegoat innocent people who are not “wasting their life” by “getting good at something”? It’s funny that you ask me vote against them now while disparaging them before.
Yes, duh, but that’s not what I asked.
Classism. Lol some rich kid who took to much shit college is gonna lecture me on what class I am.
Again there will always be rich people because some people are just better than other people. You will never stop that. There will be moms who smoke crack pregnant and make a dumb kid. Some people are just genetically unlucky. You can change who the current rich people are. That’s called war. But you will just switch who the rich people are. Not remove them.
Go see the grand daughter of Mao Zi Dong in China.
She is rich. Because all they did about classism is kill some of the current rich people, along with a bunch of poor people and make new rich people.
Just shows how little you understand about supple and demand and how finite resources work.
Did you not understand my example?
If a boss makes 90k per year how can he pay his cleaner 80k per year?
He can’t. You can make everyone poor I guess. But it will be worse not better than capitalism. And eventually capitalism will come back because it’s the natural way of producing goods and services
I get “good at something” and don’t “waste my life”, and you denigrate me for it. This just goes to show it’s never about the other person. There’s something wrong with you that allows you to treat people who don’t get good at something and fail to become successful (financially) poorly and do the same to those who do.
Also, I didn’t say what class you’re in. Poor people can be as classist as the rich, and often are.
Proof of concept: Dan Price and Gravity.
It makes sense that you’d think it’s impossible because capitalism emaciates the political imagination. A CEO must make way more than the lowest paid employee! Except that isn’t a law of nature. It’s a choice by the executive management. The fact that everyone makes the wrong does not make it right.
Okay, this is boring. I’ll see you on another thread.
That dude still owned the fucking company. And it was a publicity stunt. Elon musk goes years without a paycheck. That doesn’t mean anything. The CEO still owned the company which is worth millions when he sells it.
You keep using the word Capitalism in your critique but have not given a single example of a working solution. That spans whole economies. Because you can’t. Every attempt has failed.
Posting a fallacy. Everyone knows rich people are on average happier than poor people. Up to a certain point it has a massive improvement in happiness and stagnates above a certain point.
There are dozens of studies that show that wealth correlates with happiness. Which is kinda obvious as well.
So yes, there is a correlation.
Again, your issue is with democracy and not capitalism. Its a flawed system but the only one that will ever work in this world.
Any other option never worked out and usually had genocides as result.
If anything, the problem is probably more with the Republic concept rather than democracy. Democracy has its problem of that the minority always loses, but Republics… That’s just putting power into the hands of the few. Which tends to come back to the wealthy.
Go on. How is my issue with democracy?
What do you mean “work”? Because fuedalism “worked” just fine, too, along with monarchies and other forms of government and distributions of power. They all “worked” just fine…for everybody that wasn’t oppressed by it. I’m not sure how capitalism meaningfully differs in that respect from any of the other versions.
Your problems are all related to economics and can be fixed with the right laws. Capitalism just has the inherent problem of edging on the border of abuse of the working man if not left in check.
Democracy with short term roles has the issue of politicians chasing short term goals to convince the public to vote for them again.
We get those weird situations in which some folks get massive taxbreaks and others get nothing nada.
Feel free to correct me if im wrong.
Not just the working man. Climate change is a direct response to fossil fuel executives knowing the potential for climate change and then going out their way to suppress that information for decades. Infamously known for his appreciation of capitalism, part of Marx’s criticism of capitalism was that it devoured everything.
I’m not sure there’s a such thing as “right” laws, but yes, laws can address some of the issues. But that’s like chaining a killer dog: the second you get lax, your dog might end up doing what comes naturally to it.
I agree partly. Mostly because the last couple years we are following the best case scenario scientists predicted, and capitalism lets people innovate. We have electric cars, solarpanels etc which are cheaper than fossil fuels for the average consumer.
And these products are getting cheaper over time as capitalism supports price competition. Not to mention the fact any government can subsidize and help their paying tax members transition to a greener alternative.
If we keep up as we do now fossil fuels will be more expensive and we will transition to a fuel free future.
Capitalism might be ripe for abuse but any economic model can be abused by a bad actor. At least with capitalism its easier to turn the tide.
I personally wouldnt even read any commie literature written decades ago as its outdated in this global economy and most of the literature doesnt apply to this society. Not to mention any of the numerous attempts failed so far. Biggest example being China which switched over and got a massive economic boost and is investing billions in green energy. When they had communism as main drive millions died of hunger. Look at them now.
A true utopia would be a fascist model in which one person will decide the course of action for a plethora of decades to reform and build changes towards a green future. That will never happen.
Side note, I dont like the word “climate change”. My preference would be “climate crisis”.