• Scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech
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    2 months ago

    NOOO BUT SHE ISN’T TRANS SHE’S A TRILL WHICH IS DIFFERENT BECAUSE IT’S STILL DAX JUST FROM…

    • Real people who don’t understand symbolism.
    • Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      I don’t think the writers intended the Trill to be a an allegory for being trans. It was probably just supposed to be a cool sci fi stand in for being different. You can only show current, real life discrimination being non existent in the Federation in so many ways before you have to make up new things.

      But it also doesn’t change anything. Trans allegory or not, it’s yet another instance showing how Star Fleet and the Federation value everybody, no matter if they’re different or how they’re different. Fuck the transphobes.

      • GraniteM@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        There’s that DS9 episode where Jadzia risks exile from Trill society to revisit an old relationship, and, if not necessarily trans, it reads pretty obviously as a queer allegory.

        • Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          I still wouldn’t say that one reads as a trans allegory. The conflict arises from failing to meet social expectations, not from changes in gender.

          But yeah, it definitely reads as a queer allegory.

        • Oh, queer, sure. Star Trek has had plenty of queer relationships; she wasn’t the first. Trans is a whole different thing, though; queer is who you’re attracted to; trans is a self-identity topic. Trans says nothing about who you’re attracted to; you can be a gay trans person, a hetero trans person, a bi or asexual trans person. Trans(sexual) is about what plumbing you feel you should have, not whether you’re hetero or homo.

      • wise_pancake@lemmy.ca
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        2 months ago

        That’s how I feel, but I don’t think it takes away from people who see the situation as similar to being trans.

        And also, just in general, it’s so easy to treat trans people with respect. It’s very easy, and if you do make a mistake on their pronouns or accidentally deadname someone, I’ve never ever had them take it offensively, just apologize and we move on.

        • Olgratin_Magmatoe@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          That’s how I feel, but I don’t think it takes away from people who see the situation as similar to being trans.

          I was speaking more about the intention of the writers at the time they made the character. Seeing it as an allegory for being trans is still 100% valid despite it probably not being the intentions of the writers.

          I edited my comment to make that more clear.

          And also, just in general, it’s so easy to treat trans people with respect. It’s very easy, and if you do make a mistake on their pronouns or accidentally deadname someone, I’ve never ever had them take it offensively, just apologize and we move on.

          Agreed

          • wise_pancake@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            I think I read that the way you intended with your clarification, and it makes sense and I agree with you

    • Rhaedas@fedia.io
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      2 months ago

      I don’t even think it’s symbolism from the Klingon’s perspective. It’s a bit different with the Trill extra personality there, but the objection is the actual point. That’s still Dax in there, even though they look different now.

    • homura1650@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      Its not symbolism.

      The reason people view Dax as a trans is that they were at times male and at times female. That is not symbolic of being trans, it is just being trans.

      However, despite exploring what it means to be a trill passing through generations of hosts, the changing gender aspect of it never comes up. If Kurzon was a women, I doubt we would be talking about Dax as a trans stand-in, but I can’t think of a single plot point or character development that would meaningfully change.

      Normally I’m a believer in death of the author, so I won’t be offended if anyone wants to completly ignore thus section, but in the DS9 documentary, they have a section on LGBT representation, and their big example for it was Jadzia. However, that was not for being trans, it was for being in a gay relationship.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ya8WTQc93yI&t=5467s

    • vga@sopuli.xyz
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      2 months ago

      Dax is the “soul”, Jadzia or Curzon are the bodies. Thus it seems that the gender of Jadzia Dax / Curzon Dax is entirely defined (or perhaps not defined at all?) by the body Dax is residing in. Whereas trans people in real world believe in a gendered soul that is independent of the body they are in… right?

      But it’s not like I oppose some other interpretation of it.

    • 𝕽𝖚𝖆𝖎𝖉𝖍𝖗𝖎𝖌𝖍@midwest.social
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      2 months ago

      Do the symbiots even have genders? How do they reproduce?

      The first name comes from the host; the second name is the symbiot. Like, Jadzia was “Jadzia” before being joined, and was still called “Jadzia” after; she was just “Jadzia Dax” after joining. Curzon was the male host.

      Do you think the Trill were a metaphor for trans people? Really? Given the symbiot factor, it seems a stretch.

      • Scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech
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        2 months ago

        It’s meant to be a stretch. Star trek has always done sci-fi twists on modern day problems. It’s meant to be “Why is it not weird for this sci-fi thing to happen, but weird when it happens in our every day life.”

        Terry Farrell also knew full well when she joined that she would be playing a non-binary role through the show, and did so proudly. They also pretty much call it out directly in “Rejoined” when Dax comes in contact with her previous lover.