shoutout to the person who reported this post with “Reason: Bot meme, you can’t even read it. whoever replies is a bot too” 😂
Lmfao
beep beep boop
FTFY
Text is unreadable though
What’s funny is they could have made an actually funny joke about marxists.
Beep boop, comrade.
-pinko bot probably
Nice
Jeazus! Is that a gumdrop iMac?!
Lemmy’s biggest mistake was not calling federations “communes” or “syndicates”
Well, who said the c in c/something is NOT commune? ;-)
Hmm. Self-organizing projects whose workers work on them entirely based on their need to be done, and the results freely distributed to anyone who wants a copy?
Literal fascism, obviously.
Things like FOSS stuff makes you think people can organize and work together freely to achieve a common goal, and maybe anarchy could work. But then, you see a busy intersection when the traffic lights go out and you realize the general public are idiots and everything devolves into selfish chaos as you’re stuck a half mile back, as cars shoot through in no particular order and you inch closer to the madness terrified to make your left turn. I have zero trust in society without some form of rule and order.
Think about a roundabout though in comparison, no lights or specific order, and there is a learning curve, but overall they reduce traffic better then stoplights under many conditions.
I guess my point is sort of extrapolating that a structure/presentation also heavily influences how users perceive or use a product/idea
Decentralization doesn’t necessarily mean disorganization. You can create a Lemmy instance with no moderation and rely purely on the community itself to self moderate, much like someone can create an instance with rules, and if someone disagrees with the rules they can create their own. Both are part of a decentralized system, so no one is actually coerced into participating in any system by regulation, just social pressure.
whose workers work on them entirely based on their need to be done
You mean there’s projects out there where it’s not a bunch of individual devs all working on their personal pet features and ignoring all else?
Can’t tell if this is a joke of some kind
Agile is the anarchism of software development: sounds nice on a high level but basically no theoretical foundation behind it and thus in practice everybody makes it whatever the fuck they want it to be.
Which is how anarchism has played out so far lol
This landed.
.world won’t get it
programming.dev does not get it. Can you explain?
It is kinda obvious that maxist ideas are aligned with the open source ideas. Are they very much against commies?
There’s some weird witch hunt going on against Dessalines on there. I don’t agree with him on everything, but them trying to hound him out for being a communist, whilst using software he made because he’s a communist is kinda funny.
Honestly I am dismayed we have this dumb ass reddit culture take hold. Not everything you disagree with must be
bannned from the subdefederated immediately, your instance doesnt owe you a feed that’s exactly how you like it. Defederation should be the last resort, since it entirely breaks communication and interaction between the instance’s users.Instead, use the client side blocking features to clean up your feed. Personally I have blocked over 80 communities and users because they are centered around topics or beliefs I dont want on my feed, I blocked two instances as well, but I can still read their user’s comments and interact with their users outside the instances.
Defederating is just splintering the fediverse. Unless at all avoidable it shouldn’t be done, in fact I chose my instance specifically because it defederates nobody but meta and illegal content such as gore and csam.
I always saw open source as more socialist than specifically communist. Similar to volunteering in your community. Except the community is the whole world, and you don’t need to leave your house. Bonus!
To be honest I’d say it’s more similar to anarchism than socialism. Anarchism is voluntarist whilst socialism demands state power first. Both are ideally paths to communism* though so I’m going to say “communism” 'cause it annoys the most people.
communism as in post capitalist, post state utopia, not Stalinism*
Him being communist isn’t the problem, throwing his weight around unnecessarily is what is upsetting people. And he just keeps doing it. Like he just gets in a mood and decides to ban a bunch of people for fake violations they didn’t actually do. It’s all logged and people with high enough status can see the logs. He goes on tirades.
Aren’t the logs accessible to everyone? https://discuss.tchncs.de/modlog
At his level of power, he can apparently make some changes and then delete the log of them. Only other server admins can see it then. But I’m getting this second hand from other server admins, haven’t seen it myself.
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Not exactly. This started yesterday, when a user accused mods on .ml of, “tankie censorship,” (meaning censorship by tankies, not of tankies). He also came with some pretty good receipts that appear to show .ml mods removing criticism of China that, whether you agree with it or not, didn’t seem to violate any rules, and was well within the bounds of what most people would consider civil discourse. He also claims to have received bans from all of the .ml communities he’d ever participated in for pointing this bias out. It’s possible he’s presenting all of this with his own slant, but what he showed seems legit, and I’m not sure he could have provided more evidence without encouraging brigading.
This is now starting to snowball, with users starting to call for defederating from .ml. One .world user also posted on .cafe about Dessalines previous tankie comments, while another user has posted about finding replacements for the largest .ml communities.
So, saying what’s happing on .world is anti-communist isn’t accurate, as most the criticism has been anti-tankie. However, .world has a much higher level of liberals than most of Lemmy (they created a little echo chamber for themselves on Political Memes), and most of them are incapable or unwilling to understand the difference between a tankies and communists (or tankies and leftists…or tankies and criticism of Biden…). So, it will probably only be a matter of time before this group tries to blur the line between valid criticism of baised moderation from authoritarian apologists to general criticism of leftists.
So, tl;dr: .world isn’t broadly anti-communist, but a large portion of the community is upset about what appears to be biased moderation from tankie .ml mods, and there is a small contingent of .world liberals who I’m sure will take this opportunity to bash anyone to their left.
The problem with this is that “Tankie” is a sliding target, including all Marxists. If you claim to only have a problem with Tankies, not all Marxists, but do your best to attack the majority of Marxists, does that mean the majority of Marxists are Tankies, or that .world has become an anticommunist instance?
I’d say this will only end up creating a multipolar Lemmy. Dessalines has already stated that .ml will not be the first to defed, as they believe in an interconnected Lemmy. However, the target boogyman for .worlders has shifted from Grad, to Hexbear, to now .ml. After .world finally defeds from .ml, will they shift towards db0? Lemm.ee, perhaps? Who knows.
This isn’t the first time this has happened, haha.
Tankie used to have a specific and clear meaning
But then people not in the know learned the word without caring what it meant
So now it just means “guy that I think is an asshole (leftist beliefs optional but expected)”
Honestly i wouldn’t mind. Users on .world that don’t want a butt load of defederations will probably (and hopefully) move to another instance, whilst the rest of lemmy will be free from all the liberals uncapable of discriminating between communists and tankies
I really only started to see the meaning of tankie start sliding once I got to Lemmy, and it goes in two directions; tankies who swear they aren’t tankies, they just have a lot of feelings about why the Uyghurs aren’t being mistreated, and liberals who literally think tankie is a synonym for leftist. (Seriously, if Lemmy has one unforgivable sin, it’s introducing the, “but her emails,” crowd to the word tankie.) Personally, I don’t care if I get tankies in my feed, but I’m not OK with instances that censor opinions they don’t like (I mean, assuming they’re not bigoted). Those mod logs are pretty damning, I’d like to hear from the .ml mods why they felt those weren’t legitimate discourse.
Honestly, my real takeaway from this whole mess is that it’s really dispelled the myth of federation as a silver bullet for all of social media’s ills. Federation was sold to me as a solution to overly-large internet communities, since federation would stop single communities from becoming too powerful, and communities could simply be defederated if they didn’t get along. Meanwhile, .world is whining that .ml’s communities are too large and important to lose, while .ml is bitching that .world defederating would be egregious and unreasonable. The whole thing feels more like a flame war between some large subreddits than the glorious online utopia that I was told federation would bring us. Actually, it feels a lot like the schism that started when r/antiwork fell apart.
I don’t think .ml is whining about .world defeding, more like thinking it would be goofy, but expecting it.
Wasn’t it .world that defed from db0 already (but later added it back) because of the piracy support? Or maybe that was .ee? When that happened I moved from that instance to here.
This isn’t an attack on your comment, which gave quality information, but I think it’s relevant to the conversations linked in your comment.
Their definition of authoritarian is a contradiction to their actions and used subjectively. “I hate authoritarianism, so we should defederate to keep out the authoritarians.” This statement is supportive of a fundamentally authoritarian action.
This is also why people who use the term “tankies” seriously are themselves deeply unserious. Their understanding of the topic is superficial at best and colored only by Western biases rooted in anti-communist propaganda. The concept of authoritarianism was itself a product of propaganda.
Saying “no” is authoritarian. Holding elections is authoritarian. Authority itself doesn’t matter, what matters is who is in power and how they use their power to influence the world.
Some people recognize and accept this reality and then openly support the power that best aligns with their own benefit.
Anger at tankies is usually just a lack of class consciousness and ignorance based on a term that changes based on who you support and who you do not.
I love being able to block individual people. I’ve seen much less “pro-Biden a vote not for Biden is a vote for Trump” political compass meme shit lately because of that.
.world is basically Reddit 2, but filled with the most radical liberals that specifically want to not be exposed to leftist instances, even db0 has a tenuous relation with them.
.world is constantly on anticommunist witch hunts, and now that Lemmygrad and Hexbear are not visible to them thanks to defederation, .ml is the last large Marxist-aligned instance they can see, so it’s the new boogeyman.
One of them tried to tell me Lemmy is Capitalist because posting is value, lmao
Posting is labor 🫡
Smh Dessalines is taking my labor power
… what does that even mean …
Are they very much against commies?
We’re not, OP is just butthurt about Their Guy™ getting publicly dunked on for tankie branded censorship
I’m curious about your agile theory now !
It’s half way to self management.
Software exists in a world that kind of exists outside of property. Cynics like to think that Agile got big because as some kind of fad because the kids love it, but the reality is that fully hierarchical models just cannot keep up with self organising teams.
The old model - the model that most of the rest of the world of work still uses - simply cannot compete on a level playing field where the means of production (a cheap computer) are available to all. A landowner can stop you building your own house, but Microsoft can’t really stop you building your own software, so they still have to put in work to collect rent.
Imagine what we could accomplish as a species if the goals and distribution of resources were also decided democratically.
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My point isn’t actually about the software.
Agile is a limited form of workplace democracy that succeeded because the usual forms of disciplining workers couldn’t be enforced to stop it. It’s taken off in software because the outlay for software is so low that people can just quit their jobs and start a rival project with preferable working conditions. It’s stuck around because it’s significantly more effective than dictat.
I have problems with agile too. A lot of the “ceremonies” seem more like cult rituals and bad practices are often assumed to be self justifying when they should be interrogated. (I once had a bust up in the office because I insisted in creating a future proof test framework instead of writing just what’s needed at the time. I was overruled and I’m still mad about it).
So I guess my point isn’t even about the specific agile practices either.
The point is that workers are able to self manage when they’re allowed to, and agile has accidentally proven this to be the case. Other work places should adopt some of these ideas. And these ideas should be pushed further, into business decisions and HR and management. And physical communities etc. all the way up to actual government.
Interesting perspective, never really looked at it like that, I’ve always just interacted with the corporatized bullshit implementations of Agile.
It seems Agile really did have a kernel of worker self management in it but the original people behind it didn’t have the right ideological framework to realize that this is what they’re trying to achieve.
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Microsoft can’t stop you from building software… yet.
As I’ve been putting it: software is made of labor.
Unfortunately the actual reason Agile got big is that the cult of MBAs saw daily meetings putting scores on estimates and absolutely creamed their slacks.
268% higher failure rates, perhaps? :)
According to a company trying to sell its Agile replacement.
What a shit measure. A key idea is to fail fast and fail often, as this leads to faster growth through more frequent (re)assessment.
SW companies only care about profit. If failure rate is 268% higher but profit is simultaneously 10% higher, then Agile is the better choice.
What is impact engineering though? If it’s it’s just agile while being cognisant of technical debt over MVPs, I don’t know if it’s necessarily that different.
It seems the study was designed to sell a book and I can’t find anything about what that book says. I should probably read it but the bait way it’s being sold makes me resistant to paying to find out.
It’s much better to deliver useless projects afterall.
All this “communism is fascism” bullshit is as toxic as “if you vote for 3rd party your voting for trump”.
Fucking liberals.
*you’re
Its in quotations
I got it. I guess they need you to insert [sic]. 🙄
Isn’t “communism” essentially authorianism? I’d love to see true communism in action but humans tend to be too flawed to give up all that power.
Communism can be flawed and a flaw it is, but let’s not forget that capitalism imposing indignity is capitalism working perfectly and is not a flaw. We reward greed.
So with this communism if used correctly can lead to prosperity.
I would like to point you towards reading about the transitional period, its an important part of communism and also reading about internationalism, essentially its very hard to move from a greedy society to communism and equally its hard to be a communist country while surrounded by greedy countries.
Authoritarianism is an empty label since it’s used against one’s opposing ideologies. Rarely if ever is the inherent authoritarianism of the current or any system of government acknowledged.
Understandable. But how does a government choose the label, in this case, communism, when the it’s governed by a very small group of individuals and in most cases against the will of the people?
The governing body is the vanguard which is to downsize overtime and the country is to eventually shift to a worker lead government. It would be anarchy to deploy communism without first building the systems to allow for a workers lead government, especially off of the back from a greed riddled society and like wise surrounded by greed riddled capitalist countries.
I should also so that mention communism isnt often implemented against the will of the people, Russia pre communism was an awful place, low literary, low life expectancy and the working class/ peasantry were exploited by the west and ruling class. They had a long bloody civil war and held strong. Then after which things slowly improved under communism.
I’m definitely not an expert on this. But let’s take foss as an example. I find it to be an amazing bottom up community that contributes to itself freely. I can’t imagine how a top down system would flourish if a small group of people decided what was good for the foss community and deleted what they thought wasn’t. Is there is a distinction? Is there different versions of communism I should check out?
There’s hypothetically a bunch of different version of communism for everyone. The thing is, Marx described the problems with capitalism, and some vague sense of what socialism could be, some guidelines of what it should aim for, then kind of left the details up to each individual society to get there how they think is best based on their individual material conditions. He gave his own guesses, but didn’t think he could predict that part fully, it would be up to the people of the future to figure it out and build on. A third world country, rural serf based near fuedal society, like Russia, would have completely different needs from some post-industrial country, like if Germany turned communist, for example. If the world’s sole superpower, the US, turned communist, it would probably be a lot different than communist countries that had to transition under siege neighboring imperialism, like Cuba, North Korea, or Vietnam.
This is just to answer your last question. Don’t think this really addresses your other questions, but just wanted to explain that part, as I’ve had it explained to me before. But I generally agree with you. There should still be some form of democracy but it might look different than what we are used to here in the US or liberal west.
Its called worker lead, classless society.
foss has a legally binding licence to support itself, this licence can be seen as a vanguard as it steers and protects the software, without the licence people would be sure to steal and monetise others works. But let’s say Foss became the defacto, everyone releases free fully open and no anti feature software, we could loss the vanguard and naturally a classless system would be present.
Could a non-human vanguard be possible for a broader scope of governance? I don’t trust humanity all that much when it come to dictation.
Ah yes, nyehh
