Well, I’ll be damned. They finally won one it sounds like.
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I run e/OS, I don’t have google app store or any of the related service software installed. Yet I am able to use a cleaned up version of android and still have access to the google app store through an anonymous account using the in built app.
Epic won this case against google…
Epic lost the same case against apple, with which none of the above would be possible.
I’m not advocating for google, obviously I avoid them. But that’s BS, I hope this is used as precedent to bring a new case against apple.
Seriously this is crazy. Apple somehow winning is way worse as there is simply no way to install third party apps on IOS. Android makes the risks clear but it’s still at least possible if you click install anyway.
In terms of being a monopoly, in the US ios has more market share anyway. Google’s lawyers must have really made some big mistake.
Both lawsuits are going into round 2, afaik.
I don’t understand. Android already allows other apps and app stores to be installed, and Epic already has an Android app store you can download and install without issue. What was the argument here?
Edit: tldr: apparently it is not good enough for Epic to have their own app store, they want to have their app in Google’s app store and still not pay them money for purchases made in the app.
Google paid off other OEMs to make Google Play the default app store (much like they paid off other companies to be the default search engine) which the court decided was anticompetitive.
Didn’t Epic lose the fight against Apple? How is Google more of a monopoly than Apple? It is incredibly easy to sideload apps on Android compared to iPhones, and there are multiple dedicated unofficial stores. These verdicts are not coherent at all between them. I understand they are two separate judges, but the law should be the same for all, not at the interpretation of whichever judge you get.
Edit: for future reference, Verge answers this very question here https://www.theverge.com/24003500/epic-v-google-loss-apple-win-fortnite-trial-monopoly
I’m confused how this is a win for consumers, it just seems like two companies arguing over who gets to rake in more money.
They accidentally make rules that work for little guys also.
About the only benefit I can personally see from this is the ability to fully integrate F-Droid as an app store in my device, with proper automatic background updates, and without requiring root solutions that void my work’s security measures for mobile devices. On the other hand, I can see Huawei, Amazon, and Epic jumping to the fray with their own app stores and system services, and maybe Google Play being far more lenient with subscription services like Spotify’s in their own App Store. Altogether, I personally loathe Epic’s approach, but appreciate the consequences of their lawsuit.
This may force Google to address their terrible dispute resolution policies though. If they keep removing software without providing any meaningful dispute resolution, then I would hope that there’s a possibility for alternate repositories to fill that void.
Droidify with adb or Shizuku can already do that. But it needs Android 12+. Then it can do unattended updates.
Problem is, ADB requires enabling developer mode, and guess what - my company also blocks access to devices with developer mode on! (Also, the fact that Shizuku doesn’t work correctly over mobile because it requires stable Wi-Fi to fake a wireless debug connection doesn’t help matters.)
Shizuku only requires WiFi once per boot. But it also needs ADB, so it sadly won’t work for your company phone.
I think the Session Installer mode allows updates without a dialog for apps already installed by Droidify without dev mode or adb.
Finally a big W. Google backdoored Android with Google Play Services and gives itself special permissions that no other app can do. They should be under the same limitations that other apps are reserved to. That’s why projects like Sandboxed Google play is really awesome.
My interpretation of the article is that it wasn’t Google’s app store but the deals Google did with other manufacturers and big studios that caused them problems. Unlike iOS Android has both open source and commercial forks. Amazon have their own app store for their own range of devices and you can load that app store on regular Android I believe if you want to access a shittier range of apps. There are degoogled versions of Android and many people including myself run f-droid or side load apks. It is much more open than Apple’s system which won.
I’m willing to bet that the judge and/or jury isn’t well versed in either business or technology and made a ruling based on ignorance and confusion.
So odd that the open source platform that allows sideloading and doesn’t even come with an app store by default is the one that is a monopoly but the locked down one with total control over your device is not.
Some Android flavors even come with other app stores. Samsung phones have their own Samsung app store that even includes Fortnite.
problem here was that Google was doing deals to undermine those things
Fuck Epic, but this is a good decision for everyone.
This is so wild. Google allows side loading and 3rd party app stores…and that is the reason they were found guilty.
Unlike Apple, Google allows people to download apps onto phones running its Android operating system without going through its official app store, but the company strikes deals with phone manufacturers to favor Google’s official app store.
So because they strike deals to favor their store, even though they allow 3rd party stores to begin with, they’ve violated the SAA.
Meanwhile, Apple who refuses to allow competition or 3rd party app stores is sitting pretty because…well, they haven’t “favored” their own store over rival stores. BECAUSE RIVAL STORES CANT EXIST. I don’t know how you could favor your store any harder than that??
The legal shenanigans around all of this are frustrating to watch as a lay person.
Huh? They could just do a Fortnite.apk
No the point. Most users won’t install anything not on the app store.
Yea, but how is that a monopoly? There is even a fullon android AppStore from Amazon
Great! Now do Apple
It was ruled previously that Apple don’t have a large enough market share
But if they force Google to open their app store, I hope that do it for fucking everyone.
At least on Google devices you still can sideload apps, and fairly easy TBH. My biggest annoyance is the “you can’t buy stuff in apps without giving us a cut” which fucked up stuff like ebook apps etc
While I understand the concern over the single appstore monopoly that we have on any device, I think it’s worth remembering what ecosystem android and IOS came into.
The old multimedia phones that were sold in the mid 00s were effectively “smart”. Many of them ran java and you could install programs, and freely install ringtones, and browsers that actually worked like opera mini/mobile. The thing is you couldnt by default. At least not in the US. The devices were locked down and everything you did went through the carrier’s store. And US telecom services are some of the greediest and scummiest companies out there so you couldnt even use your own mp3 files as a ringtone.
Apple combated this with their closed off ecosystem, but android did face issues with fragmentation in the early days and needed a way to prevent the telecoms branded phones from stinking up the ecosystem. They did this by leveraging the play services and play store. From the playstore they can also since mainline release various peacemeal updates which helps resolve their other issue with fragmentation and thats android device being abandoned.
Sure enough you can still release your own version of android without it, amazon’s tablets and tv sticks do pretty well.
That said I do think it’s a good to help people move past the default and open up the platforms more, I just wish it would apply to all smart devices,
Thanks, ChatGPT.
Yup. I was part of Verizon’s app development program and it was a fucking joke. Even if the dev tools and build chain wasn’t a complete mess, and even if the dev license wasn’t expensive, and even if it wasn’t almost impossible to even get test hardware… Even if you managed to build something more useful than snake, you’d still have to wait months and months and months for Verizon to sign your apps and then months more before they’d be available on any handset. I’m legitimately not sure it was even possible for a small dev to get anything approved.
Open app stores were and still are amazing. I get that people want even more freedom, but coming from the trauma of feature phone development, I find it hard to get upset about this, especially considering Android makes it dead simple to sideload.
Huh?? They won this one but not the Apple one??
i hope this one also smashes Apple’s business to tiny pieces. All these companies are horrible horrible destructors of humanity.
If google fucking PLAY STORE is a monopoly then I hope they nuke Steam next. No excuses.
Edit: lemmings are crying bcs I threatened their favourite company lmao. Suddenly all the capitalism haters activated their one brain cell to protect their games 😂
Steam has several competitors, they all just suck, most of all EGS.
You mean like Play Store?
No, not even a little.
What? Oh FFS. Context. Yes, Play Store has competitors, so yes absolutely a lot.
The landlord also has several competitors, but when he gets all the properties for himself and the rest gets almost nothing he’s a monopolist, no? Look what Microsoft and google and hundreds of other companies did to become Monopoly.
but when he gets all the properties for himself
Then he has no competitors.
Look what Microsoft and google and hundreds of other companies did to become Monopoly.
What exactly did they do that Steam has also done?
Steam does nothing to prevent others from competing, to my knowledge, other than just being the best at what they do.
If you’re thinking steam isn’t a monopoly then why is it nearly impossible to create a gaming platform that competes with these giants? If you can’t even enter the market because of ONE company, then something is very wrong.
(Not talking about epic or gog. I mean totally new platforms)
If you’re thinking steam isn’t a monopoly then why is it nearly impossible to create a gaming platform that competes with these giants?
Depends on what you mean by “monopoly”. In the strictest sense it means they have zero competition (hence the prefix “mono”,meaning one), which is clearly untrue because we have Epic, GoG, Origin, Battlenet, Meta, etc. etc.
In the case of Google, it means they take anticompetitive measures. I’ve asked you what anticompetitive measures Valve takes but you don’t seem to want to provide an answer. Why is that?
If you mean “big business that other companies have trouble competing with”, that does not fit any definition of a “monopoly”.
It’s not “impossible” at all. It is very difficult because you’re fighting established brands that are not regional, and have decades of experience and brand recognition on you. Competing with them would require a fuckton of money and also some sort of novel features to bring to the market that they’re not. These are not anticompetitive measures, it’s just effective business.
How would you go about even trying to rectify that? Would you force Valve to give money and promotion to a competing service? Or would you just go full CCP and ban them entirely in favor of the state-sponsored Bytedance option?
You’re contradicting yourself
If I wanted to start a power grid company, I would need a fuckton of money as well. It’s called a natural monopoly.
On the other hand starting a new gaming platform is just like competing with a national power grid company. It’s nearly impossible. You become a target that’s on sight from all angles. At that moment you’re prone to pretty much every anti competitive tactic.
Tell me why no one is trying to overtake steam and why companies that actually try, are being flushed.
If I wanted to start a power grid company, I would need a fuckton of money as well. It’s called a natural monopoly.
That’s simply not what a monopoly is. You’re confused.
A monopoly is when there’s only a single energy company available, which is not the case here.
Tell me why no one is trying to overtake steam and why companies that actually try, are being flushed.
I already have. Lots of companies are doing that right now, but they all suck. I mean GoG is great as a simple game store but most publishers are not willing to sell without DRM and their store is mostly nothing more than just a store, where Steam is so much more than that.
Epic has a long history of anti-consumer behavior that has earned them a bad reputation. They’re also partially owned by the CCP.
You mean nuking the only major contributor who’s bringing games into linux ?
Linux is open source. Why don’t you find a new contributor? 😂
Linux is open source, why won’t you do it yourself 😂😂😂
Oh you know. I’m more of a closed system person 🪟1️⃣1️⃣ = 😇
Ironic considering you’re supposedly against market monopolies
Of course I’m against it, but you can’t deny they’re making top quality products!
You don’t know what you’re talking about do you.
Computers don’t come with steam automatically installed, do they? So it’s not in any actual sense of the word of monopoly.
You are been downvoted because your comment is idiotic.
Cool.
One reason out of many…
