• Dankenstein@beehaw.org
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    1 year ago

    I fully support euthanasia for terminal and incurable illnesses so if this is an attempt to make me feel guilty about people choosing to die, I don’t.

    Suicide is not something that is unique to firearms and it never has been.

    Saying the availability of something that can kill you is responsible for suicide is like saying education is responsible.

    There are much more accessible ways of committing suicide so I personally do not see where you’re going with this.

    • balerion@beehaw.org
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      1 year ago

      This is not about terminal illnesses. I too support euthanasia. This is about mental illness. The fact is that if more guns are purchased, more mentally ill people will die.

      As someone who has attempted suicide many times, I have no idea what you’re talking about. The fact is that if you want to end your life reliably and quickly, guns are your best bet by far. As part of being suicidal, I did intensive research into what the best way to kill myself was. The universal conclusion was guns. My other attempts did not work, obviously, and not for lack of trying. It is much, much harder to kill yourself than most people realize. Besides, statistics show that having a gun in the home significantly increases the likelihood of suicide.

      Gas stoves used to be a popular method of suicide. Do you know what happened when they stopped being made? Suicides went down. So yes, the method of suicide IS responsible for suicides. It’s not true that people will just find another method of killing themselves. Suicide is often undertaken on a whim and people who survive attempts often never wind up killing themselves.

      • kool_newt@beehaw.orgOP
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        1 year ago

        I’m not sure that creating a society of depressed people and then removing their means of self-harm (that are also useful for other things) is the best way to go about things.

        While suicide can never be ended, we can work to make a world with fewer desperate people, and major parts of that are things like reducing systemic racism (e.g. this post is an example), and ending capitalism.

        • balerion@beehaw.org
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          1 year ago

          I mean, obviously that’s not ideal. But even stopgap measures are better than doing nothing, and “let’s all just sit around until the socialist revolution and take no other measures to make things better” does not sit well with me.

      • Dankenstein@beehaw.org
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        1 year ago

        Why would I recommend that someone who is mentally ill buy a gun then? I was wondering why you brought this up in the first place.

        • balerion@beehaw.org
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          1 year ago

          Because when you recommend that people arm themselves, you are talking to us too. Mental illness is much more common than you think, and becoming even more common as late capitalism exacerbates the conditions which produce some forms of mental illness. Moreover, mental illness can hit at any time. Someone who showed no symptoms of mental illness before can snap one day and commit suicide or murder their family. When you recklessly recommend that people buy guns, you are increasing the likelihood that someone will commit suicide or homicide, due to mental illness or otherwise.

          • Dankenstein@beehaw.org
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            1 year ago

            Yeah, I’d recommend people do whatever it is that they want to do, given that they understand the dangers.

            I would like to own a firearm, not for my safety so I’d probably keep it at the gun range, but I know that I am not mentally stable so I don’t go and get a firearm, I could but nothing anyone will say is going to stop me if I actually wanted to buy one.

            My recommendation for people to arm themselves isn’t going to encourage to or dissuade anyone from doing so. They already fear for their lives and they have a right to own them so who am I to say that that shouldn’t? Jesus Christ?

            You sound like my mother.

            • balerion@beehaw.org
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              1 year ago

              My recommendation for people to arm themselves isn’t going to encourage to or dissuade anyone from doing so.

              Then literally why say it?

              they have a right to own them

              Yeah, and maybe they shouldn’t. There’s lots of dangerous shit you have no right to possess. Guns should be in that category. And for the record, I don’t believe the government should be sending armed people to enforce shit either.

              You sound like my mother.

              Smart woman.

              • Dankenstein@beehaw.org
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                1 year ago

                Where in my original comment did I say that, in general, I recommend that people purchase firearms?

                Even if they shouldn’t, that’s what the government is for, not me. Exercise the rights you have, you nor I have the authority to tell people otherwise.

                Anything else is fascism and I’d rather not be hypocritical in my beliefs.

                • balerion@beehaw.org
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                  1 year ago

                  You heavily implied that people of color, at least, should purchase firearms.

                  What? When the government tells you what your rights are that’s good and normal, but when a random person tells you what your rights are that’s fascism? Nothing about that makes any sense at all.

                  • Dankenstein@beehaw.org
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                    1 year ago

                    Heavily implied? So you’re assuming that I’m making a generalization without actually having made said generalization?