• FredericChopin_@feddit.uk
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    13
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    1 year ago

    Straws a literal drop on the ocean compared to what corporations are doing to the oceans.

    I am happy to have paper straws if it helps the planet, but they chose the smallest thing they could do and as always put the onus on the consumers and not the producers.

    • HeartyBeast@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      they chose the smallest thing they could do

      They initially chose a thing that would have marginal impact on consumers’ behaviour, yes. Starting in October 2023, people will no longer be able to buy plastic cutlery, plates, bowls, trays, balloon sticks, and other items.

      Which items would you nominate for an immediate ban in addition?

      Regarding consumers v producers - they literally just stopped producers selling this stuff. What do you mean?

      • FredericChopin_@feddit.uk
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        I would shift the onus on the people buying the shit (consumers) to the people making it (producers).

        Maybe we could look at fishing nets, plastic bottles etc.

        To be clear I am all for doing more for the planet but I take issue with the blame being misplaced on consumers when the producers are polluting orders of magnitude more than we are.

        • HeartyBeast@kbin.social
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          Stopping a producer selling it in a country is putting the onus on the producer.

          I don’t think the narrative of producer v consumer is particularly helpful. Any regulation that hits the producer will also hit the consumer.

          I’d be all for a ban on plastic bottles, but you need proper glass bottle deposit schemes in place first

          • FredericChopin_@feddit.uk
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            I think it is helpful.

            Consumers can only buy what’s on the shelves. If we limit production then the former isn’t an issue.

            • HeartyBeast@kbin.social
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              Whether a producer is prohibited from producing or selling has zero affect on the UK consumer. I agree that a ban on production would be good, but in the vast majority of cases these are overseas producers, so that can’t be legislated for.

              • FredericChopin_@feddit.uk
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                Then wouldn’t we regulate the imports.

                No Asda you can’t import from X because they do Y?

                Not trying to argue here, just want to be more informed.

                • HeartyBeast@kbin.social
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  ·
                  1 year ago

                  I very much doubt that there are any products being imported - because they can’t be sold - so no need to regulate that.

                  The only thing I can see where a ban on production would help with is if the UK was home to a big manufacturer-exporter of straws etc. But that doesn’t seem very likely.

                  Appreciate thr discussion and happy to have my position changed if I’m on the wrong track

        • ParsnipWitch@feddit.de
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          How much less talking about the consumers responsible is appropriate? Or do you think people shouldn’t talk about it at all?

    • aeternum@kbin.social
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      why do you think the producers are producing these things? Because consumer demand. If we stopped purchasing these things, they wouldn’t produce them. They only produce them because that’s where the money is.

      • FredericChopin_@feddit.uk
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Which is more likely.

        The majority of consumers giving a shit about anything that doesn’t affect them.

        Stopping the production of things we actually don’t want people to buy anymore.

        It’s much easier to regulate a handful of companies than it is to educate several billion people and try and get them to change buying habits.

        That’s like excusing a serial killer because victims are plentiful. You wouldn’t blame the victims and tell them to stay away from serial killers. You would punish the serial killer no?